Support Systems

[Rayzcane]

I recently located my best friend from high school. His name is Daniel Kane. Wow! That was 45 years ago. To keep this on topic, I found out that he made his living playing a touch-style instrument on the streets of San Francisco for 20+ years. He is now retired from playing professionally due to neck and shoulder injuries/pain caused from many years of "wearing and bearing" his instrument for many hours every day.

I was in a bad auto accident a couple of years ago. My injuries were also mostly in the neck and shoulder areas. So, for me, and for many others with similar problems, the weight of the instrument is a vital issue. I used to prefer sitting down, but now it is a necessity.

It seems to be generally accepted that a more vertical playing position if preferable to a more horizontal playing position. This seems logical to me to help prevent Carpal Tunnel Syndrome and other similar hand, wrist, and arm problems. What is the best way to keep the instrument in this position without feeling like a "beast of burden"?

While researching this topic, in this forum, I found references to:

Sus-Penders
MegStrap
MegHook
MegaBar
Slider Strap, et al.........

So far, the Megabar looks like the best option for sitting and playing.

http://www.megatar.com/english/accessories/Supports/supports.html

Surfing around the net for other solutions, for other instruments, produced these offerings:

Cello End Pin
Cello Stand
Electric Upright Bass End Pin

Has anyone here tried any of these ideas either with a touch-style instrument or an electric guitar or electric bass?

I have attached small .jpg images of the above three, images one at a time.

Ray

[Rayzcane]

This support looks interesting too.

Ray

[Rayzcane]

This should do the trick?

Ray

[GaryOpenhill]

Hi ray. Is the Daniel Kane connection a pure coincidence or did you know about his tapping before you got in to it? I mean, the name is not unknown, you can read posts about him in this forum: http://tappistry.org/forum/showthread.php?postid=88

But back to the topic: i have a small back problem that i have to take care off, so i practice the megatar with a lapbar 95% of the time. It's homemade, but works really well.

[Rayzcane]

The connection was not pure coincidence. He was born with a different name. :-) He adopted his grandfather's name when he started performing. A few years ago I started a mailing list on Yahoogroups.com to try to locate some of the 66 members of my graduating class at Yokota A.F.B., Japan in 1961. One of the members of that list located Daniel Kane for me. So, we made plans to meet at his place. At that time he showed me his instrument. He got slightly miffed when I said it looked like a two by four with strings. :-) (Well, by golly, it does!)

Anyway, his amp setup was in the shop or broken, so I did not get to hear it at that time. The instrument looked pretty cool. At the time, I thought that I might like to "try one out". Later on I checked them out on eBay fully expecting them to be in the $100-200 range. Man, was I in for a big shock!!!! So, my dreams of one of those went way, way back on the far back burner...... Then, last summer about this time, I invited him to my family reunion. He brought his instrument and we all "forced him to play something". He needed two amps, he said. I drug out the dusty 15w Marshall and an antique Drawf amp that quits making a sound after about 30 seconds of playing. We were plagued by equipment failures. Has anyone ever heard of that?

My first two encounters with touch style instruments just did not work out well. What really got me fired up was: A friend sent me a link to youtube with forum member Adam Fulara playing Bach on a two-necked guitar! Wow! At first I thought it must be some kind of a trick. But, further research revealed otherwise. I am an internet junkie and one thing led to another. The bottom line is that I found this forum......

Back to completely on topic: Gary, can you post a photo or drawing of your lapbar?

Last weekend I went to see Michael Kollwitz play at a local coffee shop. This was my first real chance to see someone perform with a touch style instrument. He played sitting down. I did not get to see his lapbar arrangement in detail, but it looked like a simple stick of wood with some foam padding. Also, the screw that attached it to the rear of the instrument was not tight. This allowed him to swing it back and forth (side-to-side) while playing.

Ray

[GaryOpenhill]

Back to completely on topic: Gary, can you post a photo or drawing of your lapbar?


Haha..its an wooden clothes hanger up side down, with "foam" wrapped around it (foam...the stuff inside matresses etc....dont remember the name....). The "foam" keeps it from slipping on my pink satin pants : P (kidding, of course. i'd better clarify that. i always wear totally macho chinos or blue jeans. )



Last weekend I went to see Michael Kollwitz play at a local coffee shop. This was my first real chance to see someone perform with a touch style instrument. He played sitting down. I did not get to see his lapbar arrangement in detail, but it looked like a simple stick of wood with some foam padding. Also, the screw that attached it to the rear of the instrument was not tight. This allowed him to swing it back and forth (side-to-side) while playing.

Ray [/B]

Yeah, i've seen all the vids on his site several times. And i just saw theres some new once there now. He's been on so many tv mornings shows etc, and is such a great guy, and he really looks like he enjoys playing too. I wonder if he maybe played an alto st*ck with that lapbar?

[Rayzcane]

Hey Gary,

.....a wooden coat hanger.... what a great idea!

I don't know what instrument Michael was playing. I can tell a Megatar from a *tic*, from a Warr, etc. but I don't know much about the different models.

It was interesting that you mentioned his many clips from morning tv shows. On one of them the announcer stated that he was the 6th best player in the world on his instrument! Hmm.... I wonder just how one attains that title. :) I wonder who those other 5 people are.

Ray

[Igos du Iskana]

I usualy play seated, megatar between my legs, standing on it's butt on the carpet. I let the neck rest against my left shoulder/arm. This way i can easily reach the first frets on the lowest strings with my right hand. If i use the belt, it is suspended to high to comfortably play the lowest notes. I realy like the idea of a cello endpin, but i'm not sure how to install these things. Does anyone have some experience with this? Could the conector on the back of the megatar be usefull?

[Rayzcane]

Hi Igos,

One web site that I visited suggested that a
violin shop could install it for a fee.

Here is another option:

http://www.largesound.com/ashboryarticle/mod/stand/0002/

Ray

[Rayzcane]

Hello all,

Yesterday, in a last-ditch effort to try to learn to play my Megatar Toneweaver model in and upright position, I made a simple support system. As things worked out, it looks like I will be playing lapstyle forever after.

But, maybe this idea will help someone who is having troubles with the weight of specialty touch-style instruments. This support pin should be adaptable to any instrument that has a female threaded hole on the back of the instrument. The Stick(tm) has a place for the belt hook. The Megatar line has a threaded hole for mounting the lapbar.

I held the instrument in the "proper" playing position and measured the distance from the threaded hole to the floor. In my case it was approximately 19". After scrounging around in the garage for a bit, I located a piece of wood about 20 inches long. It is about 2" wide and less than 1/2" thick. I drilled a few equally spaced holes using a 5/16" drill bit. If you play while sitting in the same chair all the time, you really only need one hole. The extra series of holes are handy if you play in your office chair, recliner, or couch, etc. If you play gigs, you may need to adjust it for other seating arrangements.

I covered the part that touches the instrument with felt. I wrapped several layers around the part of the support that touches the floor, with rubbermaid shelf liner. This not only provides a non-slip "foot". It also prevents you from marring a hardwood floor or nice carpet.

It works well and removes all of the weight from the body. Here is a drawing:

[jean_alexis]

http://www.no-square.com/index_e.html

Andre Hahne is playing bass with a support, I think it would suit a tapping instrument very well.

See the group photo for the stand.

[traktor]

The very beautiful Barker Basses use a stand --

http://barkerbass.com/

[Rayzcane]

It may just be a case of staying up all night practicing, or one too many glasses of wine, or a Divine Vision.......

Most of the support systems we have discussed in this thread use some type of apparatus that is in contact with the floor, not counting belt hooks and strap systems.

Thanks to Traktor for the link to the Barker Basses support system. One thing all of these systems have in common is a major balance problem. In other words an accidental nudge with and elbow or a knee, sends the instrument toppling over. It's a gravity thing, ya know?

How about a vertical suspension system? This could be as simple as a touchstyle instrument hanging on a rope from the ceiling! Before you laugh too hard at this idea, consider that all the weight of the instrument will be completely invisible since the body carries none of the load. It would probably work better in the sitting position since the left leg could be situated to provide the proper vertical angle for optimum playing position.

Granted, this would work better for an "at home" playstation. If you practice/play in the same physical location all the time, this just might work out ok. Does anyone see any glaring flaws in this idea?

Ray Langley

[traktor]

I'm holding out for one of those anti-gravity belts. A tiny little one, to strap around the instrument.

[rjgoos]

Originally posted by traktor
I'm holding out for one of those anti-gravity belts.


All of my belts are anti-gravity belts. They keep my pants from falling down!


Jay

[Rayzcane]

Hi Traktor and Jay, Youse guys are too funny! :)

I'm holding out for a hand transplant. In the movie "The Legend of 1900", the virtuoso pianist said: "Imagine what I could do if I had two right hands......." That would be GREAT for lapstyle!!!

As far as anti-gravity belts for holding your pants up, I use a beer belly for that purpose. And, don't forget the memorable quote from the "Karate Kid" when Daniel-San asked Master Miyagi if he had a black belt. His answer: "Yes, J.C. Penny...two-ninety eight."

Speaking of belts, I'm going to have a couple right now.

Ray

[Rayzcane]

Here is yet another support system for a touchstyle instrument:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CAtXutYPJc

Michael Bianco doesn't start actually playing until about 2-1/2 minutes into the video. He plays in a "semi-upright" position.

His instrument has 14 strings.

Ray Langley

[loneguitarist]

I've got my Ashbory mounted on a modified microphone stand - excellent for standing play. I see no reason why another instrument couldn't be mounted in this way with a heavy-duty microphone stand and the right attachments.

Adam :cool:

[Rayzcane]

Hi Adam....

Good idea! Could that be adjusted low enough for a sitting position while playing?

Can you explain a little more about the "right attachments"?

Ray

[loneguitarist]

It can hold it plenty low enough for playing while seated - in that picture it is high enough for standing but the stand just goes up and down. there I have a rubber microphone clip holding the headstock, then holding the body itself away from the stand is a microphone gooseneck with a universal mic clamp (like a big bulldog clip) on one end and a little bit of polymorph on the other end which I moulded to the shape of the strap button and then stuck over the gooseneck thread so it takes its shape. This way it is easy to take it off when I don't want it on the stand but it will still hold it securely for stand-fixed play.

:cool:

[RocknDrTom]

The vertical idea is kind of interesting. Maybe contact a hospital supply place and get one of those hooks that supports plama. Then you could hang the tapper in a vertical position from that AND move around on stage. Whether you choose to wear a hospital gown on stage with your new vertical rig is your own decision.


Another option would be to get a special pair of velcro pants made, and have the tapper wrapped in the other part. You could postion the instrument where ever you wanted and have complete hands-free movement.